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Post by dgarrett on Feb 1, 2016 2:59:19 GMT
In The Great Gatsby, every character is trying to achieve the American Dream. Each person in this novel has their own way of obtaining this dream. Tom Buchanan never had to work to get his dream. He was born into a rich family and got all of his money from his parents. Buchanan had a perfect life in his eyes and he didn't want to lose any part of it. In contrast, Jay Gatsby had to work his way into the upper class. He started from close to nothing, but ended up becoming very wealthy. Even though he didn't complete his own dream, which was to marry Daisy, he completed the American Dream by becoming as rich as he was. These two characters are foils to each other. Fitzgerald brings up this difference to show the decline of the true meaning of the American Dream. Originally, it was a search for opportunities founded by the immigrants that came to America. In the 1920's the so-called American Dream changed to people striving to become as rich as possible. What else do you think Fitzgerald means by adding this contrast of characters? |
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Post by matthewzhang on Feb 1, 2016 20:38:01 GMT
Dylan, I agree with everything except for the fact that Gatsby "worked" for his dream. In my opinion, I don't think Gatsby worked very hard to obtain his american dream. In the novel, Gatsby became great friends with a sailor named Dan Cody. This friendship allowed Gatsby to climb high in the social ladder because of how well Cody was known. And because of Gatsby's popularity and fame, he was able to get involved in the criminal scenes and sell alcohol illegally. This allowed Gatsby to obtain a lot of wealth and money. So Gatsby did not do a lot of hard work, he was able to grow in wealth mainly from Cody and then extend that wealth even more through an illegal business.
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Zachary Lloyd
New Member
Runnin thru the six with my woes
Posts: 26 
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Post by Zachary Lloyd on Feb 1, 2016 23:35:53 GMT
Gatsby the Bootlegger has a bad ring to it, I think. My Main Man Jay did not get his money in a legit way, and for that matter neither did many if any of the characters. I think this says something conspicuously about the nature of wealth in relation to the American Dream. If the attainment of wealth is the final goal to the achievement associated with the dream, it is certainly gotten to in a bad way and those people who do so are cherished in a book like TGG. In the end, the only character who dies (apart from Myrtle) is Gatsby, who is coincidentally the only one not born into his moolah.
Altogether, this says two things that aren't so great about wealth and the American dream:
1. You don't need to come by your money in any honest or industrious way- in fact it might be easier to kill your hypothetical super-rich uncle.
2. You might try your hardest to get that sweet bling necklace, but in the end you may die trying whether you were or were not exactly of the uncle-killing type.
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Post by jkeeney on Feb 4, 2016 14:37:12 GMT
I agree with the fact that Gatsby did not really work hard to attain the American Dream but I think his shift from the poor person that Daisy did not want to the wealthy, lavish person he ended up being shows his achievement of the American Dream. In contrast to the other characters in the book, he did not get his money in a legit way even though he is one of the wealthiest. I think Fitzgerald is using this to make a point about wealth in that time period and how it isn't everything it's cracked up to be. Even though Gatsby had money and many material things, he was still after Daisy. Daisy was also wealthy but was unhappy with her life and was always wondering what else there could be which is why she broke down after Gatsby was showing off all her things. These two instances show that the American Dream is probably overrated because some of the happiest characters in the book were the ones who were still trying to make a name for themselves and the ones who had everything were still looking for more in life.
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Post by ashen99 on Feb 5, 2016 4:16:42 GMT
What I think is interesting is Tom Buchanan's character. As you mentioned, Dillon, he never had to work hard to attain success because he was already born into a really wealthy family. However, readers see that he is rather insecure about himself and is particularly cruel. He doesn't seem to be happy about his life even though from the outside, it seems like a perfect life. In this way, Fitzgerald could be mocking the people born to old money. They never had to struggle to become wealthy, but they are still miserable.
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Post by katecavallo on Feb 7, 2016 18:33:26 GMT
(I know this is long sorry) To Dillon, Matt, and Garrett:
Your main point is that neither Tom nor Gatsby worked really any to gain their wealth and therefore didn't succeed in obtaining the American Dream. While I agree with this to an extent, I think we as readers need to read between the lines the Fitzgerald wrote in order to understand what he was saying about the American Dream.
I agree that since neither Tom nor Gatsby had a legit job and didn't exactly earn their money in an integrity-based way that they probably didn't deserve their money. HOWEVER, something Fitzgerald never comes right out and says is how smart both those men must have been in order to KEEP their money. Take Tom for example. He was born into mass amounts of money and married a woman almost equally as rich. This seems to be the perfect set up, right? He never had to work a day in his life and seemed to have an easy ride. But upon further speculation, the reader can realize that just because he never did any actual labor doesn't mean Tom didn't work to keep his status. In that time period people gambled on horses, did illegal things for money, and spent weekends on spontaneous getaways. For a young married couple without one job between them, it would have been so easy for them to blow through their money in a year. As the reader though, I assumed that Tom (being the man in the house) was in charge of his money.
I don't know about you guys, but I don't know how I would be able to maintain my wealth while still spending enough of it to prove to everyone else that I had it. It must have taken a lot of time and effort on Tom's part to budget (did people even do that back then?? I'm assuming so) and plan his life out so he would still never have to work, but be able to spend enough money to live the lifestyle he wanted.
The same assumption goes for Gatsby. He somehow managed to throw these gigantic parties every weekend, which likely cost a disgusting amount of money. For someone who isn't working (legally or otherwise) anymore, it sure was a major feat to pull off.
Now I'll be the first to admit that I'm not entirely sure on the whole money-system of the 1920's, but one thing I do know is that without a job (whether it's legal or not) there's no income. So for Tom and Gatsby, it must have taken a lot of brain power to make sure they remained the top of the capitalist food chain.
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Post by amytheoriginalg on Feb 8, 2016 0:34:41 GMT
Kaitlin brings up an interesting point. A lot of the times when discussing the American dream and rich characters we don't see that side. So I think that is just something really thought provoking. But the fact of the matter still is, they did less work to achieve their American dream, and it still is not fair for those who had to work extremely hard. These two men did not achieve a happy ending even though they were fabulously wealthy. They cheated the system and in the end paid the price for it. But I wonder how realistic this is in the real world?
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Post by jillian on Feb 8, 2016 5:17:48 GMT
I think it is interesting that you brought up the idea of pursuing the American dream or your own dream(s). As you said, Gatsby pretty much completed the AMerican dream (success, wealth, etc), but he never was able to marry Daisy which was his true dream and goal in life. Based off of that and your own opinions and experiences, how do you guys feel towards achieving the American Dream or your own? as an example, at a high school level, would you rather be at the top of your class with straight A's or achieve your goal of i don't know, maybe going on a road trip for a week and missing school and letting your grades fall a little? Which is more important? Going for your own dream in life, or pursuing top of the class grades thus furthering your progress towards the American dream?
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